Talk:Indochinese revolution: Difference between revisions
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== Bao Dai == | |||
The 1946 section currently has "under Bao Dai, former Emperor of Japan and de facto head of Indochinese state during the Second World War. It was, however, by the end of 1946 before the French Far East Expeditionary Force,[5] with the French acronym CEFEO, established." Emperor of Japan?!? Established what? Is it worth mentioning that Bao Dai had abdicated in favor of Ho's government and the FRench were trying to restore him? [[User:Sandy Harris|Sandy Harris]] 04:02, 2 January 2009 (UTC) | The 1946 section currently has "under Bao Dai, former Emperor of Japan and de facto head of Indochinese state during the Second World War. It was, however, by the end of 1946 before the French Far East Expeditionary Force,[5] with the French acronym CEFEO, established." Emperor of Japan?!? Established what? Is it worth mentioning that Bao Dai had abdicated in favor of Ho's government and the FRench were trying to restore him? [[User:Sandy Harris|Sandy Harris]] 04:02, 2 January 2009 (UTC) | ||
:Emperor of Japan is a big OOPS. Emperor of Annam and of the Nguyen Dynasty. Yes, he abdicated, but the French essentially reinstated him as a figurehead; I need to make that more clear. It was a very strange situation; the French essentially treated him as if he had never abdicated, not that he had any power then. [[User:Howard C. Berkowitz|Howard C. Berkowitz]] 04:13, 2 January 2009 (UTC) | :Emperor of Japan is a big OOPS. Emperor of Annam and of the Nguyen Dynasty. Yes, he abdicated, but the French essentially reinstated him as a figurehead; I need to make that more clear. It was a very strange situation; the French essentially treated him as if he had never abdicated, not that he had any power then. [[User:Howard C. Berkowitz|Howard C. Berkowitz]] 04:13, 2 January 2009 (UTC) | ||
== Chinese & Brits? == | |||
After VJ Day, the Chinese & British were given a mandate to manage Vietnam. My understanding was that was largely because the US wanted to keep France out & liberate the colony. However, the first site I find on the topic [http://members.multimania.co.uk/Indochine/hist/begin.html] says "The Chinese would occupy the north, and the British would control the south. Both powers were to stabilise their areas and remove the Japanese, preparatory to the French return. In other words, once the Japanese were out of the way it was to be "business as usual" for this French colony." Was either of those actually the case? | |||
Same site has "The Chinese ran Tonkin like bandit chiefs, and were more interested in harvesting opium than disarming/fighting nationalists." My understanding is that that is accurate. Also, they sold weapons to the Viet Minh. with corrupt generals pocketing the proceeds. I've even heard a claim that Giap's artillery at Dien Bien Phu was American-built guns obtained that way. I'm skeptical of that, but it seems worth mentioning. | |||
The British had their own problems with Communist insurgents in Malaya. so were not interested in sending troops. | |||
Does some of this need to go into the article? [[User:Sandy Harris|Sandy Harris]] 15:13, 17 February 2011 (UTC) | |||
:I've never seen the idea of splitting Indochina between China and Britain. Yes, some of the first Allied troops into Vietnam, after V-J day, were British, under Gen. Douglas Gracey, and indeed caused conflict, but soon left. | |||
:See [[Battle of Dien Bien Phu]] for details of the artillery. While I'd have to check references, my recollection is that many of the Viet Minh calibers were Soviet bloc, not used by the Allies, with the possible exception of 105mm howitzers. The multiple rocket launchers were definitely Soviet/Chinese. I can certainly believe that warlords might have sold artillery if they had the opportunity, but I don't think it was a major source. | |||
:Remember that by the time of Dien Bien Phu, the Viet Minh had taken French bases that certainly contained U.S. artillery. [[User:Howard C. Berkowitz|Howard C. Berkowitz]] 15:36, 17 February 2011 (UTC) | |||
Latest revision as of 10:36, 17 February 2011
Bao Dai
The 1946 section currently has "under Bao Dai, former Emperor of Japan and de facto head of Indochinese state during the Second World War. It was, however, by the end of 1946 before the French Far East Expeditionary Force,[5] with the French acronym CEFEO, established." Emperor of Japan?!? Established what? Is it worth mentioning that Bao Dai had abdicated in favor of Ho's government and the FRench were trying to restore him? Sandy Harris 04:02, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
- Emperor of Japan is a big OOPS. Emperor of Annam and of the Nguyen Dynasty. Yes, he abdicated, but the French essentially reinstated him as a figurehead; I need to make that more clear. It was a very strange situation; the French essentially treated him as if he had never abdicated, not that he had any power then. Howard C. Berkowitz 04:13, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Chinese & Brits?
After VJ Day, the Chinese & British were given a mandate to manage Vietnam. My understanding was that was largely because the US wanted to keep France out & liberate the colony. However, the first site I find on the topic [1] says "The Chinese would occupy the north, and the British would control the south. Both powers were to stabilise their areas and remove the Japanese, preparatory to the French return. In other words, once the Japanese were out of the way it was to be "business as usual" for this French colony." Was either of those actually the case?
Same site has "The Chinese ran Tonkin like bandit chiefs, and were more interested in harvesting opium than disarming/fighting nationalists." My understanding is that that is accurate. Also, they sold weapons to the Viet Minh. with corrupt generals pocketing the proceeds. I've even heard a claim that Giap's artillery at Dien Bien Phu was American-built guns obtained that way. I'm skeptical of that, but it seems worth mentioning.
The British had their own problems with Communist insurgents in Malaya. so were not interested in sending troops.
Does some of this need to go into the article? Sandy Harris 15:13, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
- I've never seen the idea of splitting Indochina between China and Britain. Yes, some of the first Allied troops into Vietnam, after V-J day, were British, under Gen. Douglas Gracey, and indeed caused conflict, but soon left.
- See Battle of Dien Bien Phu for details of the artillery. While I'd have to check references, my recollection is that many of the Viet Minh calibers were Soviet bloc, not used by the Allies, with the possible exception of 105mm howitzers. The multiple rocket launchers were definitely Soviet/Chinese. I can certainly believe that warlords might have sold artillery if they had the opportunity, but I don't think it was a major source.
- Remember that by the time of Dien Bien Phu, the Viet Minh had taken French bases that certainly contained U.S. artillery. Howard C. Berkowitz 15:36, 17 February 2011 (UTC)