Talk:Pauline Epistles: Difference between revisions
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Just noticed Galatians missing. I've put it in what I think is the right category, but the basis of the ordering isn't stated. [[User:Peter Jackson|Peter Jackson]] ([[User talk:Peter Jackson|talk]]) 11:32, 7 December 2017 (UTC) | Just noticed Galatians missing. I've put it in what I think is the right category, but the basis of the ordering isn't stated. [[User:Peter Jackson|Peter Jackson]] ([[User talk:Peter Jackson|talk]]) 11:32, 7 December 2017 (UTC) | ||
:Thank you. Can't think how it was missed. I am not sure if I have understood your point about ordering, but I think I originally listed them in a presumed chronological order within the categories, in which case Galatians is in the right place. --[[User:Martin Wyatt|Martin Wyatt]] ([[User talk:Martin Wyatt|talk]]) 21:56, 7 December 2017 (UTC) | |||
Yes, I was wondering whether the order was meant to be chronological. Last I heard, there were two theories, putting Galatians or 1 Thessalonians first. [[User:Peter Jackson|Peter Jackson]] ([[User talk:Peter Jackson|talk]]) 10:18, 8 December 2017 (UTC) | |||
" Some of his other precents simply reflect the values of his time" I'm wondering about the neutrality of this. This is one of the ways people often explain away scriptures they don't like. So, in this particular case, does it in fact represent the consensus of scholars? [[User:Peter Jackson|Peter Jackson]] ([[User talk:Peter Jackson|talk]]) 11:42, 21 December 2017 (UTC) | |||
:I think it is a fairly standard comment. For instance, in a commentary on Colossians 3.18ff, I find the statement that "it is for the most part run-of-the-mill ethical teaching taken straight from the Jewish (or pagan) tradition". Another commentary on the same passage says much the same about Jewish and pagan writers, and adds that the principle of subordination is assumed. It is difficult to say that the judgment is consensus, as some commentaries simply avoid the issue, presumably as not significant. Myself, I think the only thing to argue about is the use of the word "simply", which could be removed. --[[User:Martin Wyatt|Martin Wyatt]] ([[User talk:Martin Wyatt|talk]]) 15:38, 29 December 2017 (UTC) | |||
Right. On consideration, I think we have to go a bit further. [[CZ:Policies]]: | |||
<blockquote> Citizendium articles shall be as neutral, comprehensive, accurate and comprehensible as possible while respecting the balance of scientific evidence. </blockquote> | |||
[[CZ:Neutrality Policy]]: | |||
<blockquote>... we do not assume that the true view of a topic can be found among only experts; we do not endorse a "scholarly mainstream point of view," ... Expert knowledge and opinion receives top billing and the most extensive exposition. But, where it is contradicted by some significant portion of the populace (not just a tiny percentage), the popular view, as well as its grounds, should be noted as well.</blockquote> | |||
So I'm going to try a revision to mention religious views and you can see what you think of it. [[User:Peter Jackson|Peter Jackson]] ([[User talk:Peter Jackson|talk]]) 13:34, 31 December 2017 (UTC) | |||
:I've changed it around a bit, but it's only to make it (in my view) a bit more connected. --[[User:Martin Wyatt|Martin Wyatt]] ([[User talk:Martin Wyatt|talk]]) 18:03, 1 January 2018 (UTC) | |||
Latest revision as of 13:03, 1 January 2018
Just noticed Galatians missing. I've put it in what I think is the right category, but the basis of the ordering isn't stated. Peter Jackson (talk) 11:32, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
- Thank you. Can't think how it was missed. I am not sure if I have understood your point about ordering, but I think I originally listed them in a presumed chronological order within the categories, in which case Galatians is in the right place. --Martin Wyatt (talk) 21:56, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
Yes, I was wondering whether the order was meant to be chronological. Last I heard, there were two theories, putting Galatians or 1 Thessalonians first. Peter Jackson (talk) 10:18, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
" Some of his other precents simply reflect the values of his time" I'm wondering about the neutrality of this. This is one of the ways people often explain away scriptures they don't like. So, in this particular case, does it in fact represent the consensus of scholars? Peter Jackson (talk) 11:42, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
- I think it is a fairly standard comment. For instance, in a commentary on Colossians 3.18ff, I find the statement that "it is for the most part run-of-the-mill ethical teaching taken straight from the Jewish (or pagan) tradition". Another commentary on the same passage says much the same about Jewish and pagan writers, and adds that the principle of subordination is assumed. It is difficult to say that the judgment is consensus, as some commentaries simply avoid the issue, presumably as not significant. Myself, I think the only thing to argue about is the use of the word "simply", which could be removed. --Martin Wyatt (talk) 15:38, 29 December 2017 (UTC)
Right. On consideration, I think we have to go a bit further. CZ:Policies:
Citizendium articles shall be as neutral, comprehensive, accurate and comprehensible as possible while respecting the balance of scientific evidence.
... we do not assume that the true view of a topic can be found among only experts; we do not endorse a "scholarly mainstream point of view," ... Expert knowledge and opinion receives top billing and the most extensive exposition. But, where it is contradicted by some significant portion of the populace (not just a tiny percentage), the popular view, as well as its grounds, should be noted as well.
So I'm going to try a revision to mention religious views and you can see what you think of it. Peter Jackson (talk) 13:34, 31 December 2017 (UTC)
- I've changed it around a bit, but it's only to make it (in my view) a bit more connected. --Martin Wyatt (talk) 18:03, 1 January 2018 (UTC)